#i also love Jude's dynamic with Madoc

[discountsoysauce]

Okay, I'd like to preface this by saying that I'm not trying to be hostile, nor am I defending Cardan's actions by saying this. I agree that what he did was cruel and despicable, and there's no justifying that. I also agree that Taryn is a complex and nuanced character who clearly loves and cares about her sister and was just trying to survive the same way Jude was. That being said, I don't agree that the things Cardan did hurt Jude more than what Taryn did. I'm not saying I think what Taryn did is worse than what Cardan did, but I do think that Taryn's actions hurt Jude the most. At that point, Jude and Cardan were strangers. He hated her, and she hated him, and she knew exactly what to expect from that. His actions hurt her tremendously, but they were never betrayals. Everything he did was exactly in character with what she thought of him.

Taryn, on the other hand, was her sister. Her best friend. The person in this world that she trusted more than anyone else. They did everything together and trusted each other with everything they had. Taryn's betrayals hurt the most not because what she did was actually worse than Cardan but because she was someone who Jude truly trusted and loved with all her heart. (Once again, this is not arguing over how bad Taryn's actions really were it's arguing over the emotional impact they had on Jude. I can go on a whole other rant about how Jude ignored Taryn's concerns in favor of her own stubbornness, which led to Taryn feeling frustrated and ignored, but that's a different conversation). Jude puts Taryn's safety and comfort above her own on multiple occasions (letting her make an oath to never help Jude at the lake so she can get out, advising she stays behind from the lessons when she knows its going to be dangerous, agreeing to risk her life going back into Elfhame to prove her sister innocent for a crime she committed even after being betrayed) and yet Taryn doesn't really do the same until qon when she takes Jude's side over Madoc's after he nearly killed her (if you do have examples of her doing this feel free to rebutt me it's been a couple of days since I read the book).

Jude understands that Taryn made an oath to never help her, but she also knows that humans don't have to keep their oaths. Even more so than her secret relationship with Locke or tricking Cardan into relinquishing Madoc from his oath (which i will get back to), I think the most egregious betrayal Taryn ever did was leave Jude alone with Valerian. She could have accidentally kicked her chair or bumped into her on the way out or even just broken the oath even one time and apologized on her hands and knees for it after or played it off as if she didn't know Valerian was planning something. She could have stuck her neck out for Jude exactly once. And she didn't. She left Jude alone with the most violent and bloodthirsty man at the top of a tower completely defenseless. I fully believe that no matter what oath she was under, that was something Jude would have never done. And Jude felt betrayed by it.

The Locke thing to me is a betrayal but an understandable one. Taryn obviously had her reasons for doing what she did. She wanted to fit in the same exact way that Jude did, and she found her opportunity to do so. It's obvious she was torn up about lying to her, at least to some extent, although some of her actions call that into question. She told Jude that she wanted to find her place in Faerie by finding love, and Jude wanted to find it by becoming a knight. Since love didn't seem as important to Jude as knighthood, Taryn took the opportunity that was presented to her. That being said, this betrayal still hurts Jude tremendously, although it's less because of Taryn's actual actions and more how Jude perceives them.

I think this last betrayal is what especially hurt Jude. Throughout the story, the one thing Jude wanted was power. Like Taryn, who wanted to fit into Faerie by finding love, Jude wanted to fit in (or surpass) Faerie by obtaining power. While Jude didn't approve of Taryn's relationship with Locke, she does accept it. She never does anything to sabatogue Taryn's attempts at reaching her goal. She gets her a wedding gift that will make her more beautiful than her, she attends her wedding to Locke despite the betrayal she feels, she threatens Locke to never betray her sister, and she keeps quiet about Locke attacking her and stealing her wedding gift because she wants her sister to be happy. Jude never does anything to get in the way of Taryn's goal of finding love (after her relationship to Locke is revealed). The same cannot be said for Taryn. Jude had finally gotten the power she'd been vying for since the beginning. She was struggling to maintain it, sure, but she had it. Then Taryn came in pretending to be her and tricked Cardan into freeing Madoc of his oath to the crown and relinquishing control of half of their military force. And just like that, everything Jude had been working to build came crumbling. Whether or not things would have turned out differently had Taryn not done that (which I think they would have), Taryn knowingly sided with Madoc in trying to tear away Jude's power, the one thing she had been fighting for this entire time. While Jude never dared get in the way of Taryn's goal, Taryn willingly got in the way of hers. And that, to Jude, is probably the worst betrayal of all.

So yes, I *do* think that Cardan's actions were worse than Taryn's, but I do not think that they caused Jude more pain.

"we need more complex siblings dynamics"

you bitches can't even handle taryn duarte

[petratherrock]

What was it like for Cardan sitting around with The Roach, The Ghost, The Bomb and Jude in TCP? Drinking while discussing the plan to take over the crown

Like, Jude said she felt weird that she and Cardan are conversing as if they've been buddies for years, she notes that he does have his caring side (this is in the event after the bloody coronation before the final real coronation) and she keeps getting surprised by how Cardan also has emotions other than being a jerk (esp after witnessing Balekin punishing Cardan)

She's been so into trying to fit in into Faerie and thinking she has to best Cardan to find her place she never considered him having emotions (or that he was never really his enemy before) lol

But like

What was it like for Cardan? Suddenly this mortal girl he had been losing his mind over for who knows how long, of whom he's been crushing hard on is talking to him and opening up to him and he her (Jude would never own up to that tho lol), and he's seeing all these sides to her that he'd never know of if he just remained Cardan the jerk prince who wanted her dead to her

The dynamics here is

Jude : enemies to lovers

Cardan : enemies to crush to lovers

What was in his mind in that bit when they were lying on the ground and he inadvertently reached to touch her ear? Or when Jude told him that Valerian seeked her out at her house to kill her? Or when she told him, she was angry most of the time because if she wasn't, then she had to feel fear?

He told Jude all he saw prior to that was a mortal girl who got the parental love that he wanted from king Eldred, and he, like Jude was actually wrong because while Jude was loved and cared by Madoc, she was still stolen from the mortal world and basically adopted by her mother's killer, that she had to learn to survive in his world

Of all my favourite bits (other than the Court of Shadows bits, I love them), the parts where Jude finds out stuff about Cardan is very interesting to me

And I WANNA KNOW WHAT HE THINKS TOO

[tilseptemberends]

Okay, so I've finished book one and I have... thoughts.

I'm not entirely invested yet. I do enjoy a few of the characters but it's overall a much more involved read than I usually go for. Which feels weird to say because it's within the same genre. Anyway character thoughts (including spoilers) below.

I don't get why people like Locke. The second Nicassia said "he ruins things" without specifying who I knew she meant Locke, not Cardan. I can see liking him at the beginning where he does seem genuine but by the end, he's engaged to Taryn and still trying to cozy up to Jude. He also spent an entire evening making out with Jude after dressing her in his dead mother's gown which... yikes. This boy needs therapy, not a girlfriend.

As for Jude's family in Faerie. I do like Madoc. He feels like a pretty realistic father character despite the supernatural elements of the story. He clearly cares about Jude, Taryn, and Oak, despite not being their biological father. But he does so in a way that doesn't detract from how different humans and fey are in the world. It's very interesting. I like Jude, and her dynamic with Cardan by the end is fun to see. She reminds me a lot of Inej Ghafa, who I love dearly, so I'm sure I'll end up adoring Jude, too. Oak is the cutest, and if anything happens to him, I will walk into moving traffic. I'm pretty neutral on Vivi right now. She hasnt interacted with the story much yet. I actually really like Taryn. She's fighting with Jude about Locke which is... a choice... but overall, she's taking a very practical approach to a nonviolent method of surviving life in faerie.

Didn't like Dain. Liked Balekin even less. (Which is the point, I know.) Spent most of the book being massively annoyed by Cardan. Which is probably intentional since were locked in Jude's perspective. But admittedly him asking if he'd told Jude how hideous she looked that night and following it up by saying he can't tell her because he can't lie was pretty cute.

All in all, I'm not itching to read/listen to the next one immediately but I'm intrigued enough to keep going at least. Should I listen to The Lost Sisters next or just cut to The Wicked King?

[midnightrooftops]

Cruel Prince Series Review

What I knew beforehand: Enemies to lovers, a boy bullies girl in school. Originally Ithought it was modern high school and was like "weird my favorite fantasy author went that way but its a trend" and was wrong. It's fantasy high school, lol.

Pros: Madoc. I LOVE Madoc and Jude's relationship. It's so messy. I love that she loves and hates the man that raised her and that he is both a good and bad dad.

Cardan. I strangely really liked Cardan? I hate bullies and was expecting to hate him but the entire time I was reading between the lines like "Jude, I think you're projecting." He's a little asshole but he has a lot more charisma than I expected.

Cons: the storyline itself is a bit meh. A little farfetched. It was fun in the moment but anytime Jude mentioned "two months ago we were in school" I was like "yeah this is weird."

More thoughts:

I did look at some fanart while reading the series just for fun so I got spoiled a little for things. I didn't hate Tayrn like a lot of people do, she seems pretty bamboozled by a fae. Idk why that didn't read like a betrayal bc I wasnt spoiled about that but I was still like "yeah girl, you're onyour own."

I really liked the unreliable narrator. Something would happen - "Cardon stepped closer" - and then Jude would interpret it - "to get a better view of us drowning" - and the whole time I was like "girl, he's trying to make sure you dont drown." It was fun, got a bit tedious by book three but still kinda funny.

The snake thing was dumb as fuck. I could tell what she was going for and it just did not work.

Characters are ok. I dont really remember Tithe, I read it in middle school, but I was overjoyed any time Roiben was on page. It was like reading the author's fanfic about her own character, I loved it. But others, like the court of shadows, they were meh. Very tame, I think, for what I expect from faeries. I liked the dynamic of the sisters and the step mom. The brother, Oak, was often written like a toddler and then suddenly older in the last books. That felt weird but I also cannot wrote kids.

Idk it was fun and i liked it and i want to read more. Not jumping into the other books but in the mood for more fae shit (not acotar)

[elliepassmore]

The Prisoner's Throne review

5/5 stars Recommended if you like: scheming, court intrigue, faeries, morally gray characters

Stolen Heir review

First, I want to say I called it regarding Oak being exactly the kind of person you would think he would be after being raised by Madoc, Oriana, Jude, Cardan, and Taryn (and the Court of Shadows). How any of his family members were surprised by that I have no idea. I'm also happy to say that Taryn actually does seem to have gotten herself together and is much more tolerable in this book than in TFOTA (of course, that was also 8 years ago and Oak's POV is not Jude's, but still).

I enjoyed Stolen Heir but I think I like this one better. I did miss Wren's POV, though like with Oak's in book 1 having her narrate would obviously give some things away. The first book was quest-based and so we got to see a lot of new people and places, and much of the plot centered around the details of the quest. This one, on the other hand, is more along the lines of what we saw in TFOTA, where it is court against court and scheming abounds among those who want power. Questing plots are fun, but I do think I prefer this kind of intrigue.

I was so excited to see Jude and Cardan! I found it interesting to see them through someone else's eyes, since in previous books we've only ever seen them through their own, but Oak is Jude's younger beloved younger brother and Cardan's nephew and BIL, so he has a very different view of them than they do of themselves. That being said, they are more or less exactly as we remember and I enjoyed getting to see their interactions and reading their sass.

Oak is a trickster and a liar. He is, as mentioned, exactly the kind of person you would expect considering his family and the people he grew up around. He's good at scheming and seeing what people want, but he's also incredibly loyal and would do anything for his family. Unlike his father and sister, Oak still doesn't have ambitions for the throne. But that doesn't mean he isn't still involved in court intrigue, and this book shows us just how involved he is and the manipulations he's willing to use to protect the throne. It was interesting to get inside Oak's head since he's a child in TFOTA and Wren is technically a newcomer. Oak does feel like he needs to live up to what his family needs and the sacrifices they've made for him (though let's be honest, Jude's queenly ambitions only started with Oak, she sustained them on her own), and that creates an interesting dynamic. Related to this and to his scheming, Oak has so many layers and masks to portray the things he wants people to see that he also feels like people don't really know him, and it was interesting to see how that plays out.

Oak and Wren spend a lot of time separated in this book, but it's clear Wren is trying to get a grasp on what's going on and what exactly she wants. There are enemies closing in on all sides, and she struggles to find a workaround for all the people demanding things from her, and who have the power to make those things happen. While I know it would probably spoil some of what she's planning, I would've liked to have Wren's POV in this book alongside Oak's. I feel like we are missing part of the story by not having it, and I'd like to know more of her thought processes and how she decided what was a strategic decision vs not. That being said, we do get to see how Wren behaves when she feels she's been betrayed, and we also get to see how far she'll go for those she's loyal to. She and Oak have that in common, and the two are seemingly willing to rend anything, including themselves, apart in order to save those they love.

I enjoyed following the schemes of this book and learning who the new enemies were. Bogdana is obviously a major player, but there are people in the background that get revealed as the book progresses. In TFOTA, the game is putting someone on the throne and keeping them there. In this book, it's about determining who is out for the throne and what (and who) they have on their side, all while trying to balance competing priorities.

I'm particularly interested in the setup at the end of the book that seems to promise at least one more book set in Elfhame/involving the Greenbriar-Duarte clan. Holly Black had an interview that basically said as much, so I'm super interested to see where that goes (here's hoping it's Jude and Cardan again!).

Overall I enjoyed this book and seeing how Wren and Oak's story ended. It was interesting being inside Oak's head, though I did miss Wren's POV as well. I'm looking forward to future books set in this world!

[daddycardan]

Lol taking inspiration from another ask, how would u rate the main characters from ur fav to least fav w reason?

Oh my god, this is gonna be a thesis but I’ll do my best.

Jude and Cardan take the joint number one spot, I can’t decide between them. I love them for different reasons. Jude—she is a vicious, opportunistic woman, which we don’t see much of in literature. But she isn’t just crazy for no reason. She has a haunting backstory and the lack of security and powerlessness is a huge theme in her life, so she has clear and justified motivation for her horrible deeds that are done in the name of acquiring power. I say gaslight, gatekeep, girlboss. As for Cardan, he was an unwanted, abandoned child who, when he realized he couldn’t get any attention otherwise, decided to become cruel and horrible—as the proverb goes, all publicity is good publicity. To that, I say manipulate, manslaughter, manwhore.

Madoc is probably number two, just because I love how he is their father and the killer of their father, at the same time. It’s in his nature to thrive on murder, and he’s clearly very impulsive with it. But he also clearly regrets some of those decisions, and he has the spine to bear the responsibility to raise his daughters, and despite the abuse they suffer at the hands of other faeries, Madoc actually provides really good conditions for them. He loves his daughters and it’s cute. His power struggle with Jude is absolutely delicious. And his final words to Jude when he stabbed her are just heart-wrenching.

The Court of Shadows crew are Jude’s first faerie friends and they all have their unique skills and relationship dynamics. I am a bit of a Jude x Ghost shipper, so the Ghost will always have a special place in my heart. Ugh, why does he end up with Taryn tho.

Oak and Vivi are cute and supportive, and I love the relationship they have with Jude.

Nicasia is hot. And she does care about Cardan, despite the little misstep she made with Locke which she seems to deeply regret. So that makes her a little more humane in my eyes.

Taryn is a bit of a bitch and a shit sister, and she’s very selfish with her decisions, and her motives don’t really appeal to me.

Locke is the last scum of this Earth. I wish he died a more painful, bloodier death.

[eerna]

Eerna i finished TSH AND THEN found out it's sequel comes out in A YEAR idk why I'm surprised i mean ofc but damnit it's SO LONG UNTIL THEN OHMYGOD WHY ARE THERE BOOKS RELEASED SO EARLY IN THE YEAR NOW I HAVE TO LIVE FOR ANOTHER LITERAL YEAR FOR IT

Oak and Wren my beloveds they're in so much pain where we leave em at the end of the book whyyy holly black

But i really love how unconventional her stories and characters are btw. Also can't wait for Cardan and Jude actually showing up next book

Fave Oak's quote of Jude "she will wear you (Lady Nore) as a hat" *chefs kiss*

Also am I spying a potential father-in-law - daughter-in-law dynamics between Madoc and Wren? Like this man collects twisted relationships with his (step) daughters and now Wren yes pls I'd like to see more of that !!! I think he just has a soft spot for daughters (sorry Oak lol)

NOOO REST IN PIECES LOLOLOLOL getting a 2023 book 3 days into the year sounds great in theory, is horrible in practice. Glad you enjoyed it!! Oak and Wren are my babies. All atrocities instantly forgiven. Madoc is just addicted to being fatherly to messed up kids, he absolutely tried to dad Oak too but Oak is too used to it so he just rolls his eyes and goes "DAAAAD just STOOOOOOP". Can't wait for Jude to show up because I honestly have no idea how she will react. Will she be pissed? Will she be entertained?? Obviously Oak is in no danger and landed himself in this mess because he defied her, but also Wren made the entire family look like idiots. 2024 come soon

[checkoutmybookshelf]

Dead Dove, Do Not Eat

I've heard so many good things about Holly Black. I have a very dear friend who loved the Spiderwick Chronicles when we were kids. I see this book all over bookstagram and I understand it periodically makes the rounds on booktok (I'm an old, I don't Tik Tok, so if I'm wrong about this...my bad). I'm also a fan of a good classic fae fairy tale. I went into this book KNOWING that it had enemies to lovers vibes. I don't even dislike the enemies to lovers trope.

And yet somehow, I still managed to be the "I don't know what I was expecting" gif when I finished this book. Let's talk The Cruel Prince.

There were a lot of really good things about this book. Holly Black is a top-notch writer, and the quality of the writing itself is really great. Black is also an excellent plotter, and the momentum and stakes of the story absolutely held me as a I read.

I also really loved the complicated relationships between Jude and Vivi, and Jude and Madoc. The sheer messiness of those relationship dynamics balanced against the reality of Jude having to live with and navigate them is glorious and supremely well handled.

I was less enamored of the dynamic between Jude and Taryn, but that's a personal preference thing because I like when siblings get along just in general--that's my very known bias.

The worldbuilding was absolutely delightful in the book, and the stark differences between human and fae were omnipresent in a highly effective way.

So for many objective reasons, The Cruel Prince is a good book. So how did I end up Dead Dove, Do Not Eat-ed?

I absolutely detest Cardan's pointless, selfish, and gratuitous cruelty. The thing is, the book TOLD me that was going to happen. It's literally right on the cover. So...yeah, I don't know what I expected, but I could not get behind Cardan and that pretty much soured me on the series. This is very much a case of personal taste, and I know that this is a pretty beloved book and series. My plan though, is to eventually read Black's adult debut, The Book of Night, and hope that that one jives a little better for me than The Cruel Prince did.

[harmonyspopculturecorner]

The Wicked King

!!SPOILER WARNING!!

I picked up this book immediately after finishing the first one. Now that Cardan is High King with Jude pulling the strings in the background, it might have seemed like not much else could happen. However, it seems in the world of Elfhame there is always new conflict arising among the different courts of faerie. I’ll admit, this book had a bit of a slower start compared to the first one, but the plot picked up nicely once new threats revealed themselves. Holly Black continues to intrigue me with the way she has built this world and all the court  dynamics, which the reader gets an even closer look at now that Jude is a crucial part of them. I really came to love more of the characters in this sequel, especially Cardan. Even though there is still so much that we do not know about him, those mysteries almost make him more intriguing. Especially when he is interacting with Jude and making the choices he does when it comes to her. Their wedding was a surprise at first, and I wish Jude could finally get a real answer on how he feels about her, as well as her feelings for him. Madoc also grew on me a bit during this story as well. I still don’t fully trust him, but I also don’t fully hate him. He is such a well written antagonist that his reasonings for his actions are understandable. However, you also want to root for Jude and all the hard work she has put in behind the scenes with no credit being rewarded. One character this book made me dislike even more though, was Taryn. In the first book she was already annoying to me. Her choices seem very selfish and just cruel at times. However, her betrayal of Jude at the end was what has solidified my hate for her. Overall, this second book was great! There didn’t feel like as much going on as in the first, but it still kept me reading for more. I cannot wait to see what happens with our Queen of Elfhame, Jude, now that she is in exile.

[youritalianbookpal]

Ten Questions Book Review - The Wicked King by Holly Black

What is it? Jude put on the throne of all fae kind her worst enemy, and now she has to deal with it.

Who should read it and why? I think you will like this if you like annoyances-to-lovers, if you like both Sansa and Arya Stark because we stan queens in every form they come, and if the ocean terrfies you. Please also note that this won't make much sense without having read The Cruel Prince.

Which genre(s) is it? Fantasy, YA.

What is the setting? Faerie, more or less 2019. Not that it matters, but when I told a friend of mine who was interested in reading the series, she was actually surprised it's technically set in the 2010s.

How are the characters? Honestly? I've found them very interesting, especially Jude and Madoc. I thought this series was going to be way more romance-focused than family-focused, and I actually love that it's much more balanced than previously assumed. What I really liked is the investigation in Jude's (and, to an extent, Cardan's) family dynamics.

What are the strengths and weaknesses of the novel? The plot was coherent but surprising enough to be lovely. And then again, the dynamics between the characters, to me, really make the series brilliant. However, I think the pacing was a bit weird to me. After the wedding everything sort of felt a bit weird, as either too fast or too slow - and it suits the plot just fine, considering what is going on, but it still felt... Non-fluid to me.

Did I cry and/or laugh? The banter sure is fun in this book. And, while I didn't cry, there's parts of the story that still tugged my heartstrings.

Who shouldn’t read the book? Don't read this without having read The Cruel Prince. Also, this one is stilly pretty dark in some parts, so please consider checking out a proper trigger list before reading it.

Any random comment? It's really not ok how giddy this made me while reading.

Which quote stuck with me?

I want to tell you so many lies.

[silkiemae]

Queen of Nothing by Holly Black

(Sorry ya'll I didn't write a review for Wicked Prince but I rated it 5/5)

My Rating: 5/5

I think the reason I love Jude Duarte so much is that she fought so damn hard to get where she is. She started as an ordinary human with no special prophecies or hidden powers. She's not the most special beautiful girl with the most unique powers ever. She's an ordinary human girl who clawed her way to the top. And I love that about her. 

I'm usually not an enemies to lovers fan because it always feel imbalanced to me. Usually the man in the relationship is so much stronger and more mean to the girl and he always gives a pitiful apology and she just forgives him and falls head over heels for him. I love that Jude is just as bad as Cardan and just as much a force to contend with. Sure, Cardan is a faerie and he has certain powers that Jude does not but Jude is just as strong as Cardan in her own way. I really like their dynamic together and I'm such a simp for the two of them together. 

At the same time, I would like to kick Cardan out of the way and marry Jude myself but I understand that that's just not possible. 

Taryn, while I often wanted to punch her in the head throughout the first two books, grew on me here. While I was not always happy with the choices she made, I understand why she made them. Jude betrayed a lot of people too and I cheered for her. Taryn betrayed Jude and I think that's why I was so upset with her because Jude is my WIFE. Also, how dare you do that shit to your sister. Although killing Locke won me over. I really hope in The Stolen Heir we see that the Ghost has stolen his way into Taryn's heart and is helping to raise Locke's baby. 

I find the politics throughout this entire series fascinating. I love the dynamics of faerie. How everyone is a cruel, manipulative bastard. I love the complicated relationship between Madoc and his daughters and how they can't help but love him despite how awful he is. This was just a really fun series, I really had a good time reading it. It's a breath of fresh air to finally like a protagonist this much and to like the love interest just as much.

[sheepfulsheepyard]

ok omg so i also haven’t actually read any of holly black’s books that don’t have to with greenbriar drama™ so i totally didn’t clock that, and i LOVE it.

the idea of creating a court is soooo juicy in a political landscape full of nigh-immortal beings. like, the founder of the greenbriar dynasty is cardan’s great-grandmother despite there being, what, a thousand years or more between her uniting elfhame and cardan’s crowning? jude’s narration talks about the reverence that the folk have during eldred’s abdication (before it’s interrupted) and while obviously he’s the high king, i imagine that that sort of longevity and timelessness to political dynasties and dynamics probably carries over throughout elfhame as a function of the long lives of the fae. i can’t help but wonder if the idea of creating a court almost physically changes the landscape is some way—like, it’s such a large shift in elfhame that it actually produces a physical reaction. cardan (and later jude) as high king is connected to the land, but I wonder if the kings and queens of the lesser courts get a lesser version of that power?

im obsessed with dynamic of the ghost and taryn having seen the absolute literal worst of each other before they see anything resembling the best. like, if taryn’s seen the ghost as nothing but a weapon pointed at the people she loves, what does it feel like when she realizes he can actually protect her? or if the ghost has seen taryn seamlessly ingratiate herself with the folk, what does he feel like when he realizes she can genuinely charm and care for him, too? idk something about your mask being drawn from a portrait of who you are at your core but in colors you don’t know etc

i feel like the edges of the wild is such a terrifying place for taryn and the ghost to be because they’re two characters who ive always read as clinging the most desperately to their roles. the two of them are absolutely gutted when their respective people who they built their futures and identities around (dain, locke) began to use and twist and abandon them. i feel like this would be a special kind of horror in particular for the two of them, because suddenly neither taryn nor the ghost have predetermined roles anymore, especially around each other, and to suddenly be able to redefine yourself when you’ve been driven by nothing but regrets for so long would be, i think, a bit terrifying.

i think bringing some of the extended family (leander’s grandfather/taryn’s father in law, the ghost’s mother) would be SO interesting in part because the family trees in the series are already so wack. i love drama and i also want to explore more of taryn’s sword lessons with madoc that she got (and apparently excelled at!) as a kid because that is ENTIRE nother layer of family drama to mine because i feel like a scene where taryn holds a sword and the ghost successively flashes back first to jude and then straight to madoc because taryn’s grip and stance is the same would be so JUICY !!!

brooooooo i have not stopped thinking about the taryn/ghost court of shadows mission to another court

bestie 🫣 I am SO sorry that I am SO late but i promise i was literally thinking about every day because i was like i have VIBES but i need WORDS to respond!!!

okay, so i was super inspired by your idea of taryn luring all of the queen’s enemies to her for the court of the shadows by pretending to be the dissatisfied, slighted sister. and i was also turning over some ideas about the “wild” faerie who more or less shun the courts and reside the deeper, feral woods because locke’s father was a wild fae but—here was what got me—the ghost’s mother is also (implied to be) a wild fae.

and so the premise is that one of the lesser, smaller courts that’s situated much deeper into the woods (the “court of evergreens” or something idk) finally come to pay their respects to cardan and jude at the palace. since it’s such a comparatively backwater, remote place, being around two years late isn’t necessarily the faux pas that it would be. most importantly: it’s the main point of contact for the vast majority of the wild faerie, so the actual court itself is much smaller in comparison to other courts, with most participants being wild fae who cycle through every couple of decades and stay for a few years and move back out to the wild.

and when the lord of this court shows up to the palace, he decides that as a rural prince, he’s missing out on the trends of all the other gentry. so: he requests that the king allow him the hand in marriage of the queen’s mortal sister. after all, if the king of elfhame has a mortal queen, shouldn’t all the other faerie lords ought to follow suit? imitation the sincerest form of flattery (and loyalty), of course.

[and this is where some actual plot that I haven’t thought of yet would have to kick into gear, mainly what the evergreen court’s lord is larger goal is, why he actually wants a mortal bride to show his loyalty to cardan, how the court of shadows picked up on something suspicious, etc]

a whole running thread I’d like to also tug at is whether or not the wild fae are actually more or less human than the gentry we’ve already been acquainted with—in their looks, in their seclusion, in their regard for mortals—so also a part of this is that the lord is subtly disregarding jude as queen and taryn as his bride, but going straight to cardan.

but. basically this boils down to the court of shadows agreeing to a plan that taryn puts forth. she will go to the court for a year and allow the lord to court her so she can gather information all the while. it’s decided the lord has a year and a day to woo her before he proposes to her.

jude does not want any of this to happen, but taryn—who has only recently been granted something like probation/liaison status with the court of shadows—is very desperate to prove herself not just to the court but to herself. she wants to prove that she can charm and play and manipulate the faerie better than locke did her.

now, the catch is, of course, the ghost is going with her as her “attendant”/bodyguard/contact. and the ghost is watching all of this from sidelines somewhere between disbelief and growing anger, because he saw snippets of how miserable taryn was with locke, and he cannot believe she seems to want to replay this entire drama again from the start.

leander’s there as really the only anchor and i want a huge part of this to be like. taryn trying to figure out what went wrong with her, with locke, with them together, to somehow come up with a satisfying explanation—she secretly wants to see if she can find locke’s father, though she’s terrified of what that would actually mean in consequence. basically taryn trying to stumble her way back through her own decision-making and looking for a future.

but more on the day-to-day side is her and the ghost essentially fending for themselves in hostile environment that is also nothing but revels, picnics, hunts—so they’re so very close to each others’ own decision-making it’s starting to get extremely personal. I really, really want the ghost’s mother to show up—maybe as the member of the court, maybe not even recognizing him—and idea that taryn and the ghost really are on the edge of the wild, the edge of mortality, the edge of a mask. something something how you’re both living in an elaborate masquerade with everybody but each other.

this was VERY rough im so sorry I don’t even know if this is making sense ahhh!!! but here are also a couple of fun points i wanted—

when the lord of the evergreen court comes to propose to “the queen’s sister” in front of the entire court he does NOT make it clear which one and vivi immediately hides

locke’s father shows up at some point and maybe tries to. i don’t know. kill taryn for killing locke 🤷‍♀️ we love family drama

the wild maybe grow to less human features the more time they spend in the wild? i’m wondering how this would affect the half-human ghost…

taryn and the ghost sleeping back-to-back to guard for intruders

the ghost gets brought along as part of taryn’s retinue and as leander’s “sword instructor” despite the fact leander definitely isn’t old enough to walk

anyway thank you for putting your amazing tarynworks out into the world 💖

[badnovels]

im reading cruel prince rn and my god its so gooooddddddddd!!! i love vivi so much so far!!! uggghhh!!

SUCH A GOOD BOOK. Of course I’m probably dropping a curse on us right now since it’s a series and we have no idea how it will end up, but so far it’s just the right amount of edginess with an awesome heroine and enemies-to-lovers things happening and interesting family dynamics. But yes I love Vivi too! But omg I can’t stand Taryn. -_-

Anyway let me know when you finish and we can discuss.

[slightlyrebelliouswriter23]

I think everyone dogs on Taryn because this is Jude’s pov. We get an insider look into how much she’s hurt and that it’s coming from her own twin. But if Jude can break bread then the taryn’s haters should to. If they dislike taryn as a person, they need to take that hate up with the man who made her the she is: Madoc.

I also have a head cannon that in the future Jude and Taryn continue to grow as people, now that they can finally get out of the constant survival mode. I think they grow closer the older they get.

you're absolutely correct, nonnie.

i think people will be shocked to find out how Taryn-neutral i am. despite everything i've said to defend her, my thought when finishing the series for the first time was exactly that: if Jude can forgive her, then we should be able to, as well. it was a very simple, no bells-and-whistles forgiveness. i think Taryn is extremely interesting, i think her character is poised and ready for a beautiful arc, but i wouldn't trust her as far as i could throw her.

also, i've said this before and i will say it again: Madoc getting every single exemption and grace from the same people who condemn Taryn to shame on main is some kind of bullshit.

the mental gymnastics you'd have to do to say that the dude who continuously tries to manipulate Jude and her actions for his own gain, who continuously patronises/underestimates her throughout the series, and who straight up murdered her parents in cold blood in front of her cos he felt slighted, is more redeemable than a teenage girl who was 1) just trying to survive in a cutthroat world and 2) honestly was just doing what Madoc told her to do? would be laughable if it weren't so damn sad.

this isn't to knock on Madoc, either. i think he's a fantastic villain, an extremely fascinating character, and i love the dynamic between him and Jude. but there's no denying he's done some straight up reprehensible things to all of his daughters. and the lengths some people will go to defend him while at the same time tarnishing Taryn's name is wild to me.

now, i'm not saying people can't dislike a character just because. Taryn is Not a likeable character. so if your opinion of her is "she's just not for me", i think that's valid.

what i am saying, however, is Not Liking Things to the point where you make hate posts using main fandom tags, send people asks demanding they defend why they like a certain character, start discourse in the comments of posts celebrating the character you dislike, is the antithesis of fandom.

fandom is meant to be a joyous celebration of the fictional worlds/characters/things we love. if you don't like something in fiction, that's fine. but the moment you make your poor opinion of something other people's problem is the moment i take issue.

–Em 🖤🗡

p.s. i love and agree with your HC. i think that is an accurate representation of irl sibling dynamics, as well.

In Defence of Taryn Duarte

more theories/analysis/opinions

[angrylittletrashpanda]

Let’s talk about Eva and Madoc?

I admit Madoc is one of my favorite characters from the TFOTA trilogy. His relationship with Jude is very complex and many-sided, what made me enjoy following the family dynamics far more than reading about the “Judran” romance. We cannot deny the Grand General is a perfect example of a morally gray character- despite his violent nature, he was a very devoted father, willing to give his children the world. I strongly believe he wanted to seize the throne not because he was a cartoonish villain, stereotypically bloodthirsty and power-hungry, but due to the fact that making his (mortal) daughters princesses of faeries was the only way to secure their safety. I find his reaction to Jude being fed with Everapple was heartwarming in a way, since it showed his immense attachment and concern about the girl (although I have to admit Madoc, yelling he would find the faeries who did it, rip out their hearts, cut off their heads and mount them on the roof of his house sounded like a stereotypical father of a teenage daughter, what made me laugh. I bet he would have wanted to do exactly the same to Cardan if he had found out what happened in TWK, CH 15). I used to perceive him as a good, caring parent, who was doing his best to raise his human wards to be tought enough to survive in the dangerous fairyland and… succeeded! It was also mentioned that the fact that he used to treat the Duarte twins as if they were actual fairy ladies was unusual (and made some gently born a-holes furious). Of course Madoc committed numerous mistakes while bringing Jude, Taryn and Vivi up, but  come on, no parent could be ever called perfect!

Fanfictions usually show Madoc as a positive figure, in the modern AUs he is a quite strict father, who desperately does not want to admit Jude and Taryn aren’t his little girls anymore (which is quite funny), but eventually accepts the fact that they have grown up and want to fly the nest.

Also, I don’t hide I was a bit disappointed when “HTKOELTHS” turned out to be some moments from TCP from Cardan’s POV instead of, for instance, a prequel about Madoc and Eva. I admit I tend to romanticize this (I guess) passionate romance that ended up as tragedy and wonder why Jude’s mother eventually decided to run away from her first husband. There were  certainly numerous cultural differences, and also his violent nature could have made her feel uneasy, but I think he truly loved her and used to do his best to be a decent husband.

On the other hand, Eva MUST HAVE HAD an good reason to leave him. I simply refuse to believe she decided to flee from Elfhame just because idk, Madoc kept forgetting to take out the trash, used to walk around the house wearing ugly ass sweats, frequently threw his socks on the floor or something of sorts. Was she afraid? Of what? Of the fairy land? Of her husband? Did the things become complicated (even for faerie standards)?

And now, think about a scene from TQON. I mean the one in which Madoc told Jude she had always been good but never good enough. Just imagine how his words must have hurt the girl, who desperately waned his acceptance/used to do everything to prove her worth. In addition, she heard them not from a random ass dude she didn’t really care about but from her FATHER FIGURE. Could Eva have guessed that Madoc was capable of such abusive behaviors/ mental cruelty? If so, I am not surprised she decided to keep her unborn child away from this guy.

[lafleshlumpeater]

UPDATE I'VE ALMOST FINISHED THE LAST BOOK (stopped reading just after they did the tickle tackle 🤭🤭 i lovecardan so much broo) and thoughts (spoilers):

idc what anyoneee says about madoc, i love my morally grey (leaning more towards evil) characters and NOTHING could make me hate him. also i might make a rant post abt his and jude's relationship bc it's so interesting and special to me. also i felt SO BAD for the ghost mannn like my poor baby :(( im just glad taryn did something good for jude bc what was she doing atp she literally just kept making life harder for jude although i guess in a way she helped her gain her rightful title back bc she wouldn't have known cardan's sneaky loophole in the whole exile thing so she's got that going for her, i actually don't outright hate her anymore because it was getting close to it right at the start of book 3. anyways back to the ghosttt i am SO glad his betrayal wasn't through his own choice bc i love him so much and i loved the dynamic between him and jude. also can we talk about the bomb because she's so iconic mannn ('long live jude, no thanks to me *wink*'). ALSO WHY TARYN GOTTA EXPOSE GHOST'S NAME TO EVERYONE LIKE THAT CARDAN WAS THERE AND THE ROYAL GUARD AND SM PEOPLE CAN NOW CONTROL HIM LIKE HUHH COULDN'T SHE HAVE JUST WHISPERED IT LIKE JUDE DID WHEN SHE COMMANDED CARDAN TO ACCEPT THE CROWN IN BOOK 2?? but fine whatever i guess she saved cardan and jude and the ghost from the guilt of what he would've done, my heart actually shattered into a million pieces when he insisted that jude had to kill him (the way he was like 'i'll show you how to do it where it'll hurt the least- my last lesson to you' that broke me fr). CAN WE ALL TALK ABOUT THE PART WHERE CARDAN AND THE ROACH AND JUDE WERE GOING THROUGH GRIMSEN'S FORGE AND THEN ONCE THEY WERE CAUGHT CARDAN WITH 0 HESITATION GAVE HER THE IMPENETRABLE CLOAK LIKE. I SCREAMED OVER THAT ACTUALLY. but tbh throughout the whole madoc chase i was screaming internally like HAS SHE LOST THE CLOAK??? WHERE IS THE CLOAK?? bc i think it's so cool but yes. unfortunately she lost the cloak but unlike me cardan Did Not care. ALSO I LOVE HOW CARDAN HAS ZERO SHAME LIKE IN BOOK 2 (I THINK?? IVE READ THEM ALL TOO CLOSE TO ONE ANOTHER TO DIFFERENTIATE ANYMORE) WHEN THE ROACH AND THE BOMB WERE LIKE 'jude could be glamoured' AND CARDAN FULLY GOES 'CRAWL TO ME' LIKE BOYYY. also the shameless flirting in front of the bomb but tbh that was also jude but cardan fr went to the next level. i love him also SHOW ME those letters he sent lady fucking asha bc i bet my sanity it's just begging and crying for jude to come back actually

how convenient that the cruel prince starts with 'on a drowsy sunday afternoon' and i decided to start it today of all days